Does a "Modern Rite" Lack Power?

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Tsiyeria on July 9, 2009 at 7:17pm

Logically, I'd have to say no, it doesn't. Simply because, at some point, those ancient and traditional rituals were new.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by AlanHeartsong on July 9, 2009 at 7:18pm

It's intent and focus that makes the difference, so it doesn't have to be ancient to work well.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Amergin Coll O'Danann on July 9, 2009 at 7:30pm

It just seems that the older a ritual is, the greater weight it carries in the pagan/new age(forgive the term) culture and the marriage of say spirituality and tech get poopooed. Or modern writing, in my case comic books as a reframing of ancient tales would get me tossed out on my head even among other pagans.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by AlanHeartsong on July 9, 2009 at 7:36pm

Depends on the pagans, I guess. Comic books *are* a reframing of ancient legends and old heroes in many cases. Not all, but there are some.

Many people (not all) are under the assumption that what we have today is worthless, and the older something magical is, the more powerful it must be. They disempower the time we live in and themselves with this attitude, and cut themselves off from a lot of experiences looking for "the one true ancient way".

Writing something new yourself can be more powerful to you, or people you work with, than getting some nonsense out of a book that someone else wrote 20 years ago. Something written 200 years ago wouldn't be terribly relevant to our lives today, and if anyone claims to have written rituals older than that, then I'd have them check history books about literacy levels in the country they're claiming it comes from. A lot of peasants couldn't read or write, even in this country.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by SIN on July 10, 2009 at 9:55am

Well said Alan.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Robert Chapman on July 9, 2009 at 7:46pm

YAY for comic books! My very first Goddess "statue" was a Storm action figure... lol

I agree with what everyone else is saying. I would also add that if you were to witness my group do ritual, you'd think we just stepped out of the amazon or some other non-modern place, but I promise you that our ceremonies are approximately three years old. And they are truly awesome and inspiring. So rituals are like people...some get better with age, some just get outdated and wrinkley. lol

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Robert Chapman on July 9, 2009 at 8:06pm

I just wanted to add that as for the "traditional" part of your question, there are Wiccan Trad rituals that carry their own energies and act as triggers to awaken specific aspects of the psyche and connect with specific deity energies and the like. So for those types of rituals, there is great power in the traditional use of them. So they would probably fall into the realm of rituals that carry more power simply because they are older and secretive and have been used for very profound and powerful purposes over the years. Initiation rites would be a good example. There are a few threads going on right now about such things if you feel like searching for them. ;p

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by ScorpioDragon: The StudWitch on July 9, 2009 at 8:33pm

The magician holds the power, not the rite.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Shadow Moon on July 9, 2009 at 9:20pm

I think it's hard to say what is traditional considering Wicca, in it's modern form anyway, is only about 55 years old if you consider it officially began with Gardner's publication of Witchcraft Today in 1954. I realize the religions base principals are older than this, but if you just consider Wicca, it is a modern twist on ancient Pagan principals long lost through centuries of prosecution and hiding.

So I do not beleive the Wiccan rites is any less powerful since most ancient traditions have been lost and reformed many times over the generations. This also seems to be true with many other Pagan traditions, unless you are lucky enough to find a old book filled with detailed writings about specific rites, most have had to take on a modern theme to survive, which I think is healthy because if a religion cannot change it just becomes stagnant.

The power is within the person, not the herbs, candles, crystals or other tools, in reality these are just physical assistants to help reserve some of the magick or energy used in the rite. In short visualizing everything takes a lot of practice and concentration so tools are awesome energy savers!

Since the power is within the person the rite can only be as strong as the person regardless of how newly created the rite is.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Rain on July 10, 2009 at 9:45am

Not that rituals are the only way to tap into the Divine; no, it doesn't need to be ancient. If the intent that is your will; thats all you need.

▶ Reply to This