Skyclad is ritual nudity #2
Skyclad is used to refer to ritual nudity Part #2
Well than if you feel this is new age thinking UMM! maybe it could be age of new thinking. Something most have not come acrossed or experienced is someone abusing skyclad . Any kind of not having clothes on would be considered nude period. to some peoples veiws. because it could be taken as or considered pornagraphic in some twisted unimformed mind.
Well it has come up and I guess that is why I personally posted the discussion for people to think about. I do UNDERSTAND were stating in a reply post "I NEVER in all my years as a witch ever considered being skyclad anything having remotely to do with anything pornographic." Well I guess it was consider.( no not pornagraphic, or how could it be pornographic? or where did this come from to even compare spiritual nudity with porno?). in ones choice to reply to this discussion it made each person think and debate and discuss. If being spiritual was all present in skyclad than we all would not have a issue. But, if given a chance to be twisted into something less than it's attended meaning, it could be veiwed as pornagraphic. If one had lack of knowledge what the beginnings of skyclad... who, what, where; The knowledge of skyclad came from. Skyclad can be used negatively to control another person whom has no knowledge of its true meaning .
I wish we could say that no group of people have not twisted the Great Rite to become a reason for having a sexual orgy under the title of Holding and carrying the cone of power. Can we just turn our heads and pretend that some have not twisted the 5 fold kiss into a way to make themselves out to be the God or Goddess by demanding those in the group to just show them honor by demanding every member to perform this to them on verbal demand. Worse those involved have no knowledge or no clue that they do not have to have sex with the high priest or priestess or whom ever they point to be the sexual partner as a requirement to belong to a coven or the person can not see they even are being used as sexual slaves in the name of Witchcraft by to me for lack of words or title for sexual preditor using titles like High Priest/High Priestess.
I know how I worded this discussion it came across unclear and more like a shock jock on a radio program, but it is getting more people to think and make better choices and see different views and have some knowledge that they may not have had if they did not read this discussion on Skyclad.
Where does Skyclad and Porno.. start and stop? I started with where Skyclad it came from.. Now I want to see where it stops being the sacred per say.. and goes into becoming a issue that could be taken as pornographic. I am sure in time this discussion will take a stab at how anybody that practices any rites without clothing or robes is a disgrace , and also leads us right to anybody that is naked is wanting sex. or anyone naked wants to be raped (just looking at where many have gone there already in post). Far fetched ? actually this Discussion may have many under and over lying layers. But is that not a form of Discussion?
It did make me angery to read the statement "Sounds like something us olde witches never worried about to begin with.." You need to worry when there are people out here posing as High Priestesses and High Priests under the disguise/ cover of the Craft abusing people whom have no knowledge of the true meaning behind things in Paganism.I then feel the stated "us olde witches" Than whom ever you claim in that as olde witches need to stop standing by your cauldrons stirring the laundry and look and see those whom are being abused by those whom twist The Craft to fit their own non-Craft ways ..Your knowledge and teachings (pointing my finger at us olde witches) are needed so our people learn and know the true ways.
Well than if you feel this is new age thinking UMM! maybe it could be age of new thinking. Something most have not come acrossed or experienced is someone abusing skyclad . Any kind of not having clothes on would be considered nude period. to some peoples veiws. because it could be taken as or considered pornagraphic in some twisted unimformed mind.
Well it has come up and I guess that is why I personally posted the discussion for people to think about. I do UNDERSTAND were stating in a reply post "I NEVER in all my years as a witch ever considered being skyclad anything having remotely to do with anything pornographic." Well I guess it was consider.( no not pornagraphic, or how could it be pornographic? or where did this come from to even compare spiritual nudity with porno?). in ones choice to reply to this discussion it made each person think and debate and discuss. If being spiritual was all present in skyclad than we all would not have a issue. But, if given a chance to be twisted into something less than it's attended meaning, it could be veiwed as pornagraphic. If one had lack of knowledge what the beginnings of skyclad... who, what, where; The knowledge of skyclad came from. Skyclad can be used negatively to control another person whom has no knowledge of its true meaning .
I wish we could say that no group of people have not twisted the Great Rite to become a reason for having a sexual orgy under the title of Holding and carrying the cone of power. Can we just turn our heads and pretend that some have not twisted the 5 fold kiss into a way to make themselves out to be the God or Goddess by demanding those in the group to just show them honor by demanding every member to perform this to them on verbal demand. Worse those involved have no knowledge or no clue that they do not have to have sex with the high priest or priestess or whom ever they point to be the sexual partner as a requirement to belong to a coven or the person can not see they even are being used as sexual slaves in the name of Witchcraft by to me for lack of words or title for sexual preditor using titles like High Priest/High Priestess.
I know how I worded this discussion it came across unclear and more like a shock jock on a radio program, but it is getting more people to think and make better choices and see different views and have some knowledge that they may not have had if they did not read this discussion on Skyclad.
Where does Skyclad and Porno.. start and stop? I started with where Skyclad it came from.. Now I want to see where it stops being the sacred per say.. and goes into becoming a issue that could be taken as pornographic. I am sure in time this discussion will take a stab at how anybody that practices any rites without clothing or robes is a disgrace , and also leads us right to anybody that is naked is wanting sex. or anyone naked wants to be raped (just looking at where many have gone there already in post). Far fetched ? actually this Discussion may have many under and over lying layers. But is that not a form of Discussion?
It did make me angery to read the statement "Sounds like something us olde witches never worried about to begin with.." You need to worry when there are people out here posing as High Priestesses and High Priests under the disguise/ cover of the Craft abusing people whom have no knowledge of the true meaning behind things in Paganism.I then feel the stated "us olde witches" Than whom ever you claim in that as olde witches need to stop standing by your cauldrons stirring the laundry and look and see those whom are being abused by those whom twist The Craft to fit their own non-Craft ways ..Your knowledge and teachings (pointing my finger at us olde witches) are needed so our people learn and know the true ways.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by bkyrdwtch on -
There are moments in my practice that I go naked. I don't refer to it as skyclad. And I am always alone in nature when I do practice it.
do any of use really think that the old ones went skyclad?
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Permalink Reply by Scarlet on -
They might have if they were in a very warm house and raising energy.
I know that's why I do it.
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Permalink Reply by Maximusstormcrow with Meat sauce on -
Umm No!
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Permalink Reply by Witch's Mark on -
And yet almost all of the old carvings and paintings of witches and witchcraft ceremonies of the past almost always depict witches in the nude. I don't think that ceremonies were practiced all year long in the nude outside, for instance in the Winter outside, but I truly believe pagans in the past practiced nude at some points.
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Permalink Reply by Scarlet on
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I think your confusing pornography with sexual predation.
Pornography is a picture, video or other image that could be seen as sexual. Since most people don't take pictures or make videos of themselves in skyclad ritual, ritual nudity has little to nothing to do with pornography. If some twisted mind thinks that nudity is always related to sex (and there are some out there... example, the people who think breastfeeding is obscene), that's one thing, but it's not pornography without a recording device.
If people are abusing the idea of skyclad ritual or the idea of the great rite as an excuse to get unwilling partners involved in sexual activity, that's horrifying and terrible, but it's still not pornography unless you take pictures of it, etc...
-Scarlet
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Permalink Reply by Maximusstormcrow with Meat sauce on
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I did Not get the Privilege to Read on your first post of this topic. So, I am going to answer as best I can. I know For me, Skyclad in my own rights are ok, but I still do not feel the need for them. I find when I dawn my Ritual Robes, and my tools of choice for that Rite, it has quite literally set my mind into doing work for that Rite. I suppose that If I had no others to work with, and all I could find was a Skyclad Coven, then Well I would have to work alone.
I have never know Skyclad to be Porn, it never struck me as such. I know for me, It would be a Distraction to see such beautiful women naked before me, and not be able to work on the task at hand. Would I Act on Impulse to make a relationship with them? No. I think It would become Porn if I was to try to mate with every girl in my group, and film it. Then It would be porn. If I was just trying to mate with all of them because I thought them Beautiful, Then that is just because I was horny, and couldn't get my head out of the gutter. I know myself enough to know that These situations would make my life very complicated, And I know myself enough to know that I like to chase them, But I think it rude of me to put my self in that situation, and rude of me to know that I would be Prone to that.
Well, I hope this discussion goes well for ya.
Be well.
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Permalink Reply by Athena Meteor on -
Being Skyclad is not about physical beauty or physical ugliness. There is simply nothing about the human body that needs to be hidden before the Powers. Age and body-fat do not make bodies ugly, they just make them different, and no one should ever be shamed by the ignorant, 'your tits are not perky enough to be seen and your ass is too fat' judgmental crap coming out of some people's own bodily insecurities.
When one stands Skyclad along with mastectomy survivors, amputees, and burn victims, one learns about the bravery behind the scars and the truly heroic will to live that some people possess. One also learns compassion, not just for others, but for oneself. There are no rules about being naked-- there is only the truth of it. The young look smooth because of inexperience-- the old have been hanging from the Blood-Tree for a lot longer, while Old Woman Time carves living runes into their flesh. These runes are Sacred, and those who wear them worked hard to earn them.
I have no doubt that the ancient tribal peoples of the world saw things in much the same way as I do. All one has to do is look at the Venus of Willendorf and the Venus of Lespugue to know how fundamentally skewed modern humanity is with regard to how it views its own physicality. The Ancient Mother does not wear clothes, because She has nothing to hide and nothing to lie about-- Her Power is self-evident. To clothe Her is to diminish Her Power, which is the same rationale behind face-veils and burqahs. Essentially, clothing tells lies-- lies about age, sexual nature, trustworthiness, power, status-- you name it. My Goddess is naked before me, so I am naked before Her. It's a sign of fundamental truthfulness, equality and shared Power. What being Skyclad is not about is superficial good looks or thrilling the opposite sex.
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Permalink Reply by Minstrel_Davyn on -
Agreed.
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Permalink Reply by Robert Chapman on -
I can't imagine wanting to do ritual naked. First of all, have you ever sat with a copper drum between your legs with no clothing to protect you??? COLD! Secondly, have you ever run through the woods with a spear without some sort of clothing to cover at least the private parts??? Running while naked causes all sorts of bouncy, uncomfortable things to happen. Much of my religious and spiritual ritual takes place outdoors, in forests, lakes, trees, stones, etc. Being naked would be silly and expose your body to mosquitoes, ticks, hikers, etc. But I guess some people do ritual inside??? And for that I guess it's ok to be naked, but I honestly don't see the reasoning behind it. I think it all started back in the "free love" days, when people were more likely to end the night with orgies. lol Not that there is anything wrong with orgies..... ;p
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Permalink Reply by Noli on -
I don't know...some folks would say it goes back to 1899, Aradia; Gospel of the Witches
"And as the sign that ye are truly free,
Ye shall be naked in your rites, both men
And women also: this shall last until
The last of your oppressors shall be dead;"
Of course there is debate about the authenticity of that text to this day. Either way, after Lelands translation (MIStranslation?) of the "original" Italian text it still wasn't until the 50's that people really started going Skyclad and making a point about it.
I see your point though about nudity just not being practical, but not everyone runs through the forest during ritual either. A ritual performed on the open or under a big tree in a field or some such thing...just standing in a circle might decrease the risk of "bouncy, uncomfortable things" ;) tee hee....but I think that description is funny..tee hee
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