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All Beliefs are Welcome Here!

This is my response to Sat-Sekhmet's blog and I want anyone confused about the group and it's purpose clarified I've bolded Sat's responses.

Let us see if you can handle what you dish out Sat. I'm the creator of the group, when I re-post this on my blog I will NOT moderate comments. I am not offended by what people say. Hell, I made a youtube video about a video game and got called a name for it. Thus, is life.

Sat: You know who you are. Over the years I’ve been a member of Pagan Space, I’ve watched each of you demean, belittle, criticize, and otherwise attack many of the members of this site. When you find anything in posts or discussions which you don’t like, you, you take it upon yourselves to derail the discussion, post derogatory comments and graphics, and/or otherwise libel the beliefs and viewpoints of other members. You seem to take pride in silencing others or causing them to depart the site. You’ve even taken your personal Meanies group private so no one can see what you’re up to.

You didn't name any specific members, however I know who you're talking about. There is one admin for the Meanies club. That is me. No one else contributes to admining the site or even offering advice on how to run it.

That being said, I made the group private. One of the reasons I did was because I was sick of people trying to use the club against people they did not like. As I had anticipated people would be wrapped in paranoia such as yourself. Almost all the content you saw before it was set to private, is largely the same with an exception of some comments and they are not really at anybody in or out of the group.

If you took the time to go through the comments section you would have seen Starrfire did indeed post on the club. The club is self-satire for people who were not trying to be mean, coming off as rude and offensive to members of the board simply for disagreeing. It is a joking club. In fact, this very blog is funny enough to be a topic there. If it was against board rules Starr would have pulled the plug years ago.

I thought I made it clear we weren't serious with the images and saying things such as "poopy-head". As for the membership being similar to people you've seen on the board, I can only account for my behavior. I do not take account for their behavior outside of the club nor is that my responsibility.

The group has always been open to all members of paganspace and still is. Not a single person complaining about the club actually posts there at all. I find this whole blog to be detestable, simply because any problem with the actual club could have been addressed to me to clarify in private. Since it is now public, and you've passively-aggressively called some members out, including myself, you will expected to handle what you've started and will be held accountable for your own words and generalizations.

Sat: Nevertheless, almost everyone here is familiar with your tactics by now:

1) Repeated posting of negative statements against any argument deemed “illogical” or without substantive “proof”, according to your ill-defined standards, which are nominally referred to as the “rules of debating”.

Says who? Where is that posted in Meanies club Sat? When was it posted? Did you imagine this? I've never actually read any rules of debating. SIN has the Fight Club group, yet you are not attacking that for talking about formal vs informal lines of debating.

2) Relentlessly asking for more information or further clarification, and then declaring what is provided to be inadequate or insufficient.

This is your own personal problem, Sat. There are members of the board, such as myself who are naturally highly skeptical people. It has little to do with the Meanies club outside of being called names, ridiculed, and attacked for asking, which is then part of the satire of Meanies. Stop projecting your conceived "social problems" on the Meanies club. Why should everything online be taken at face value?

3) Providing no position of your own or stating that you’ve already given your position in another topic; just search for it.

This one was aimed at me. I'm under no requirement to answer anyone, not even _M. Furthermore, I have been financially in ruin atm so I have been POSTING FROM PAGANSPACE VIA MOBILE, for the last few days. There is no mobile version of this site. When I answered him I 1) Didn't want to type a long post up for him to dissect from my goddamn phone. [We would just go back and forth and I didn't feel like it.] 2) Go and look for the links to my posts when A. my Blackberry barely makes adequate tabs and when there is too many tabs, it closes/loads slow. B. It takes a lot to load this damn site on a phone. 3. Lastly, PS may or may not eat my posts, causing me to type something up, select copy, and gamble every time I hit submit twice. Because oh no, it's not going to submit the first time you push the button on the phone!

Now, if you had me on facebook and saw my status, specifically being posted during the time I was on PS, it'll say "posted from Blackberry". Likewise, you would have known I haven't had net for awhile at my own goddamn house and I am a full time college student. To top it all off I just recently came back to PS after the fact my old mobile browser stopped loading this site, so I had to SEARCH for a new mobile browser, which there is not a lot for BB, just to come back to post. Also, I'm on a school computer RIGHT NOW as I have told you I was coming over to reply to you about this. If you wanted MY reasons for not answering _M, you should have came to ME instead of making accusations about my intentions. Oh, and the reasons I didn't answer your original reply to ME, was because Starr closed the thread by the time I saw it on my phone.

Sat: 4) Labeling statements as UPG as a way of discounting a perspective or belief.

Bull shit. UPG is unverified and is not a fact. I do not have to be forced to believe in your UPG and it's akin to asking for someone's opinion. It is not based in science whatsoever. It represents peoples' experiences. Questioning such experiences such as "Are you sure that was X god?" is not an "insult". There is not reason anybody on this board has to believe your or my upg's because you say so. In fact if you add up all upg claims you'll notice that they conflict, sometimes with history and sometimes with each other. Hence the diversities of pagans. If you want to shove your religion or spiritual experiences down someone's throat, take it somewhere else.

Sat: 5) Saying all you want to do is have a discussion.

Debates and disagreeing opinions ARE discussions! So are questions. Did you go to school? In literature class they will tell you all stories have CONFLICTS, this is a matter of human life. Why on earth to you expect everyone to agree?

Sat: 6) Accusing anyone who pushes back of being a “troll”, all the while never admitting to your own trolling practices.

I've seen _M attack people who were not doing anything to him. He attacked several Heathens, their religious views, and so forth. He is not a victim and you and him being grown ass adults are perfectly capable of taking accountability for your actions. Don't say you NEVER lost your cool here Sat, I've seen it.

As for _ass, she isn't "innocent" either. I know because of this group and I saw her bash and attack Marie for something Marie said that wasn't even insulting that she blew up about on PAGANSPACE. She made multiple STATUSES attacking Marie. It was crazy.

Sat: 7) Posting scurrilous blog posts disguised as “information” which degenerate into personal attacks on individuals who have crossed you, or to whom you have taken a dislike.

Actually this is your own insecurity and passive-aggressiveness showing. I'm taking an educated guess you're talking about me and Nick, of which they are not P-A attacks on members. This is your perceptions. Again, private messaging for clarification would be nice.

Sat: 8) The simultaneous arrival of most or all of you in the same discussion, each posting similar disruptions to the existing conversation. How anyone with half a brain could possibly consider this coincidence I'll never know.

This has nothing to do with the Meanies Club or any "conspiracy" against members on Paganspace. People chose to post on what topics. It includes me. There's plenty of topics I've ignored because I just don't care about them, whit list I've seen SIN, Marie, or someone else take an interest. I am not in control of other peoples' behaviors and what they chose to post on, neither are you.

Sat: 9) Posting highly personal attacks against individuals, sometimes pointed at aspects of personal habit or appearance.

That's funny because the "meanies" you're posting about don't normally do this, although certainly rather recently a member called both me and Vig "fat" for disagreeing with her and she's not in the Meanies club or the little "clique", you think we have, at all.

Sat: 10) Stating that “the other person started it.”

*rolls eyes* How is this blog not stirring the pot Ms.Sat?

Sat: 11) The multiple postings of slang terms, names, graphic pictures of sexual organs and/or innuendo, i.e. f***knuckle, “d***head”, “a**wipe”, etc.

So instead of taking this issue to individual members you took it up with the entire club?

Sat: 12) Calling people “whiners” and repeatedly saying that all they have to do is stop participating in the discussion if they don’t like the responses.

That is true, that they are under no obligation to reply. I've kept my keys away from the board when I see certain members of the board reply. Don't want people disagreeing with you? Don't post!

Sat: 13) Declaring anyone who dares to “question” the content and/or validity of xtianity must be either an ex-priest, or ex-nun, or ex-minister, and therefore an unreliable “butt-hurt” former xtian. These people are repeated told to “get over it.” Yep, every pagan is just a “butt-hurt” former xtian. . . .

You know what, you've honestly made me mad. I have posted criticism about Christianity, but a lot of people on this board make topics over and over bitching and bashing it. This I have a problem with SINCE CHRISTIANS ARE WELCOME ON THIS SITE. It's on your own page. Starrfire has also repeated this. I don't mind constructive criticism or opinions such as "I don't believe in the Xtain god." but that's not usually what's posted. What's posted is usually "All Christians are guilty of X." and forgetting that like Christians they are human too, and prone to the same failings. After awhile, I get really tired of "OMG look at what Christians are doing! Let's go bash them some more!" Bigotry fighting bigotry only adds fuel to the fire.

Sat: 14) Denying any of these tactics when called on them, declaring you’re just being satirical or ironic. Do any of you even understand what the words means?

Do you? It seems over your head.

Sat: Several of you were my “friends” here on Pagan Space. I have removed you as such. It seems to me that in having you as a “friend”, I am condoning your behaviour, when in fact that is the last thing I would ever wish to do.

You are not responsible for your friend's behaviors. I am not responsible for my friend's behaviors. Instead of taking this issue in private to your former friends you rather just come on the blog and complain? If you don't post this on your moderated blog, it is of no matter. This is being posted on MY blog as I have seen you didn't post my last comment, because imo, you're misleading people if you want only one side to post and no one to defend themselves.

Sat: For the most part, I have not spoken out about your behaviour. I have remained silent and watched many of those whose friendship I treasure either stop participating or leave the site altogether. Who would want to be subjected to this day after day, week after week? Moreover, when long-time thoughtful and strongly contributing members such as Freyja’s Man and Celtic Lass are repeatedly subjected to your outrageous and ugly behaviour, there is something radically wrong going on.

You can have fun looking at the link that shows _ass's outrageous and ugly behavior attacking a member of the forum after she repeatedly clarified that was not what she said/meant.

Sat:I refuse to remain silent any longer. From here on out, it is my intention to call this behaviour wherever and whenever it appears in any discussion/blog to which I am a party. It matters not to me if I stand alone. Regardless of what anyone else thinks or does, I’m finished condoning your actions as an acceptable standard here on Pagan Space.

Similarly, it's hilarious that you attack an entire group rather the individual members.

Sat: These are my opinions.  I stand by them.  If you wish to come after me, so be it. I’m ready. Bring it on.

Clearly. You want a world with out conflict. Not gonna happen.


Views: 476

Comment by Maris Hellfaerie (Maire) on February 7, 2012 at 7:42pm

14) Denying any of these tactics when called on them, declaring you’re just being satirical or ironic. Do any of you even understand what the words means?

I really love how this slimy asshole attacked me for one of the few comments I made that illustrated my naive failure when confronted with sexism at the working place, when I "bragged" about how I "Bullied my sexist boss with my logical arguments". Because I am "an asshole like that" always "trying to work things out by bullying people with discussion". Fucking meanie that I am.

Typical for this hateful sexist that he believes me to show my true colours when I draw an unsympathetic, willfully distorted ugly satire of myself just because I don't want TO FUCKING COMPLAIN.

What an idiot.

Comment by Maris Hellfaerie (Maire) on February 7, 2012 at 7:46pm

I forgot to add that I don't care about the "he said she said" and not wanting to be friends with people who don't like my friends and such shit. I don't care whom people I happen to like, associate with. I have nothing against Sat and never tried to win her over or anything stupid like that. I am not Celticlass who is trying to gather people who will jump ion the face of those I don't dare to confront.

Comment by Maris Hellfaerie (Maire) on February 7, 2012 at 7:56pm

I am of course not just a self declared meanie. I am an evil nazi spawn, full of darkness, who wants to discredit the whole pagan scenery and make them look like a collective of meanie poopyhead.

Comment by Raindust on February 7, 2012 at 8:17pm

But we wubs you anyway, maire nee-san. *_*


(Sorry, I couldn't resist. And yes I am going to start calling people nee-san/nii-san. This is how far I've fallen.)

Comment by Maris Hellfaerie (Maire) on February 7, 2012 at 8:24pm

Thank you, Woad. You are very easy to like, yourself.

Comment by Lilitu Wind on February 7, 2012 at 8:42pm

"I do have to add, though...after reading this post, that it also calls people out, which we're not really supposed to do. "

I don't think I'd normally call people out, except to their face. However, she had did the same. it's kind of hard not to say anything, really.

Comment by David Carron on February 7, 2012 at 8:43pm

FM being an a-hole.  Shocker.  I remember...  nope, he was always intentionally ignorant. 

Comment by Lilitu Wind on February 7, 2012 at 8:43pm

"Sorry, I couldn't resist. And yes I am going to start calling people nee-san/nii-san. This is how far I've fallen."

S'ok Otaku sister, the bad thing is I understood you. 0_0


Comment by Lilitu Wind on February 7, 2012 at 8:45pm

I don't understand the whole 'Don't attack me and MY friends!' thing. This only is good entertainment fodder to watch these people, really, overreact.

Comment by Starrfire Price on February 7, 2012 at 9:21pm

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but any reference to people you dislike (ie: using their name/screen-name) needs to be removed from this blog. I'm going through all this drama sitting on the front page of the site and noticing anyone who is at fault of the same thing.


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